Interview with Diane Schroer
HRC: I’m here today with Diane Schroer. For her whole life, Diane knew she was meant to be a woman, even though she was born a man. In 2004, Diane began to transition from male to female. She also retired after 25 years of military service as an Army Special Forces officer, where she had spent her career specializing in counter-terrorism operations. Diane was later offered a job as a counter-terrorism analyst at the Library of Congress, but when Diane told her new employers that she was transgender, they withdrew the offer. Diane, tell us about the job you applied for at the Library of Congress. What were the responsibilities of the position?
Diane: The responsibilities, I thought, were tailor-made for the experience that I had. It involved looking at the threat that we were facing as a nation, assessing our capabilities, determining the new capabilities that were being developed and how to incorporate those, or what would be the best way to incorporate those, into an overall strategy against the war on terror.
HRC: And you were highly qualified for this job?
Diane: Well, I certainly believe I was. I was hand-selected to created and orchestrate a 120-plus person classified organization in the Department of Defense to do essentially the very same thing. And I think we did that very successfully for the two years of my tenure there.
HRC: Could you tell us about the application process for the Library of Congress?
Diane: It was fairly straightforward and routine — what I’d guess is routine for a federal job. I saw the announcement on the USAjobs website and went through the formal application process. That involved creating an electronic application with a resume and your specific qualifications for the job. I was notified about 30 days later that, in fact, I met the qualifications and that I was being considered for an interview. In early October, I was called in for a very extensive formal interview. If I remember correctly, it lasted about three and a half hours. And then a good period of time went by. I understand they had about 18 applicants that they were actually doing live interviews with — that were selected from a much longer list of applicants. And then in early December, I was told I was one of the finalists. In a short list of three, if I remember — three or possibly four. And they asked for, again, some very detailed specifications and some writing samples. I sent those off straightaway. Again, following that, they asked for an updated list of references. They contacted a number of people I had worked for in the past. And then finally, I was called by who would be my new supervisor and told that I was clearly head-and-shoulders above the rest and was their selection for the job. And they just wanted to make sure that I was still interested before they went through the administrative burden of filling out all the paperwork.
HRC: And how did you feel when you found that out?
Diane: Oh, I was elated, actually. I was very pleased.
HRC: How did first tell your future boss about your transition?
Diane: After a series of two or three phone calls discussing salary and, in general, time frame and start date. When it was clear that she had forwarded my name, I suggested that we meet for coffee or lunch because there was something that I wanted to discuss with her. So, in fact, we did that. We met the week before Christmas for lunch, and after meeting in her office and her introducing me to a number of my new colleagues, we went to lunch. She proceeded for the first half of the lunch to tell me how much I would like working there and explaining to me the procedures and how significant it was that I was coming in at the time I was coming in — that would allow me to integrate fully into their cycle of doing business. And then I kind of segued the conversation into telling her that there was a personal issue that I wanted to discuss. And then I told her that I was transgender and would, in fact, be starting work as a woman.
HRC: And what happened after that? How did she react?
Diane: She was surprised — as I think most are — but recovered very quickly. Actually I think her first question was, “Well, do I change, then, the name on the hiring documents — because they’re virtually complete — from Dave to Diane?” And I explained that no, my legal name change had not completed through the process and my security clearance was still in the name of Dave, and that no, the hiring action, as it stands, would take place under the name of Dave. But I would start the first day as Diane, and for everyone’s comfort and simplicity, I thought it was best that we just start that way right from the very beginning.
HRC: How did you find out that the job offer was being withdrawn?
Diane: She called the very next day and said, “After a very long and sleepless night, I’ve decided that, for the good of the service, based on our discussion yesterday, you are not a good fit. You are not what we’re looking for.”
HRC: And how did you feel when you heard that?
Diane: I was shocked, and then I was kind of devastated, actually. And I just told her how very disappointed I was to hear her say it.
HRC: Why do you think it’s important for federal law to protect transgender people from job discrimination?
Diane: For the very same reason that it’s important for federal law to protect everyone from job discrimination. That we’re a country founded on the principle of the best people for the best jobs. That’s one of the things that makes us successful. And allowing policies that are counterproductive to that — that single people out one way or the other, either for favoritism or discrimination — is just not beneficial. It’s not helpful at all.