SONiA: Talking About It Podcast Transcript
SONiA is a Grammy-nominated singer/songwriter who has been playing her brand of heartfelt, political, melodic folk music for decades, both as a solo act and as a member of her band, Disappear Fear. Out and proud for almost twenty years, she was a contributing artist on HRC's first musical compilation, Being Out Rocks, and her new CD is DF05 Live by SONiA and Disappear Fear. Learn more about SONiA at her website, soniadf.com.
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SONG: "I'm the Enemy"
I never wanted a catastrophe
But I called my mom, she said, "Turn on your TV."
Suddenly, everything was changed
The sky is raining with four burned planes
Yeah, I'm the enemy
Because I've got a color TV and I'm an American, too
Yeah, I'm the enemy
Go to work, pay bills, try to support my family
Thank God for freedom in red, white and blue
And I don't want to go to war
But it seems that violence has blown off my door
And I think of my little ones in bed asleep
And how I'd do anything to keep them safe and free
Yeah, I'm the enemy
Because I've got a color TV, I'm part Muslim and Christian and Jew
Yeah, I'm a double whammy
Take your aim, I'm suicide candy
Thank God for freedom in red, white and blue
(Hebrew line, followed by Arabic line)
Living all together
And if I am not for me, then who am I?
And if I am only for me, then what am I?
If not now, then when?
In six thousand years, have we learned anything?
Yeah, I'm the enemy
Because I've got a color TV and I'm an American, too
Yeah, I'm the enemy
If you free the lambs, what will the lambs eat?
Thank God for freedom in red, white and blue
And green, and gold, and purple, and ochre... (etc)
Mark Shields, Director of the HRC Coming Out Project: This is Mark Shields coming to you from the Human Rights Campaign building in Washington, DC, and I'm sitting down today with SONiA of Disappear Fear fame. She's a Grammy-nominated singer-songwriter-artist who's contributed to - in addition to her own CDs, an incredible body of work - is a contributing artist on the HRC "Being Out Rocks" CD, and we're so glad you're here today, this is such a treat.
SONiA: Thank you. It's great to be here.
MS: Let's start with the basic thing that we always ask people when they sit in this space: when did you come out?
S: When I came out and there was no going back? (laughs) Because I came out in pieces, really.
MS: I think we all do.
S: Yeah, but for sure my first real relationship was when I was 22. So yeah, it was beautiful. My gay anniversary is May 7th. We always celebrate it, we just call each other wherever we are in the world and say, "Happy Gay Anniversary!" (laughs) Very original, I know.
MS: I love that. We were just talking a moment ago about your family and I read once that you actually gave up the opportunity to perform in Madison Square Garden because you had promised to be in your nephews' talent show at their school.
S: Yes.
MS: How do you talk to your family, and especially your nephews and younger people, about being gay and what that means and how that touches their lives?
S: Within my family, I think how I am is more, is the biggest part of, like my presence, that I take my partner with me to events, and that we're still affectionate, and that we're who we are. It's a process. And I've encouraged other members of my family, too. I have a cousin, and her parents are very rejecting of her gayness, and it's been incredibly hard. They're in such denial about it, and it's really silly. She shares a house with this other woman who has two children, so they have a whole family together, and they've been together for three or four years now.
MS: They're a family.
S: Yeah, definitely, and it's undeniable. It's beautiful. They live in Texas. I just keep being me and keep sharing that. I think one thing for me, too, about the whole gay thing and the evolution of it in my own being is that it's a human experience. Of course we need special attention because we need to redefine love in this country politically, in that love is love. So we have to make a law called "love is love," and we need great groups, we need this organization, to clarify that for people who are confused about what love is. (laughs) That love only looks like this, which is ridiculous. So anyway, just by being that, hopefully that helps.
MS: Your band's name, Disappear Fear, grew out of work that you've done with survivors of sexual assault.
S: Yeah, that was where the name came to me.
MS: You said that it does apply to homophobia as well. What is the best way you think that GLBT and straight-supportive people here in the U.S. can help to disappear fear? What can they do in their lives, what do you talk to people about?
S: By living out loud. Loving out loud. I think that's the greatest thing, you know. And that's really just telling the truth about who you are and how you want to live your life. And the better you treat yourself, the better you're gonna be to your partner, to your boss, to your community, to your family. I think it so important - for me, anyway, I have these sensitive feelers and they go out so far, and then I have to remember to come back in and take a hot, steamy bath and gather myself. And just be nurturing, to ourselves, really. I think that's a very important thing, and then that helps to take a deep breath and say, "You know, this is who I am, and this is the love I'm bringing into this world." And there's nothing like it. We're all - every single one of us is completely unique. Every single one. And perfect. And so, it's that expression, it's that sentence, that only you can give. And if you're all bottled up in saran wrap, and you can't be you, that's not good for me.
SONG: "Me, Too"
S: (spoken) This song is a song that's on the HRC compilation CD. It also appears on the fortieth anniversary edition of the Philadelphia Folk Festival. This is Laura Cerulli joining me with vocals. It's a story of a father and a daughter who, the father was a soldier in the Vietnam War, and he served three tours in Vietnam, yet he encouraged all of his children to follow their own hearts, which in one case was to protest that war. The idea, too, truthfully though, is as big as love. I should say the epiphany in the song is really love. I talk too long. (laughs)
Her daddy was a soldier in the Vietnam War
And she was proud to see her father in a fresh-pressed uniform
He came home on a stretcher in 1966
Welcome back - fellow Americans throwing tomatoes and sticks
He said, "Darlin', don't you worry, there are two sides to everything.
I did what I believe in; I want you to do the same.
I stood up for my country, and that's a solid bet.
And I'll stand up for freedom every chance I get."
Because America shines on me, in front of me
All the world could see if they wanted to
I raise this flag for you,
Me, Too
She grew up on a bible, she grew up on love
She grew up thinking she could change the world, she only worked hard enough
She became a lawyer, hoped to marry a good-looking man
But she fell in love with the girl next door, so that wasn't part of the plan
Because America shines on me, in front of me
All the world could see if they wanted to
I raise this flag for you,
Me, Too
The years spin by while the corn grows high
For every train you catch, you miss one
So watch your life just racin' by
It's time to tell Daddy this one
She sat down in the corner, she could still see the door
She said Daddy, I've got to tell you something I've never said before
He said, "Shhhh. Everybody has a war."
You see, it's not about oil, and it's not about guns
And it's not about rainbows, it's about daughters and sons
If you believe in tomorrow then I have taught you well,
'Cause if you don't believe in yourself, life's a living hell
And you'll always shine in front of me
All the world could see if they wanted to
I raise this flag for you,
Me, Too
Well, I raise this flag for you,
Me, Too
MS: You are releasing - just about to release - your brand new live CD.
S: Yes.
MS: DF05 Live, SONiA and Disappear Fear. Did I get all that in the right order?
S: Yeah, DF05 is the name of it, it's by SONiA and Disappear Fear. That's perfect, Mark!
MS: What is the experience of recording a live album, when you're on the road?
S: It was crazy. I mean, we didn't know if we'd have an album, really, at the end of it. I really wanted something that was sort of like a musical documentary, which is definitely what it is. Just like, the outtakes and intakes are all in it. (laughs) It's unedited.
MS: That's always so fun.
S: Yeah. And it's two-track. It's not like we went back and buttered something up, even though I would have loved to tweak it in places. You can't, and that still drives me a little crazy. You know, it's hard to step back from a piece of work, any work, even when you make a studio album. You're working so much, you know, many many hours, just cutting it down and refining it to what you really want it to be. It just becomes amazing. But at some point you have to stop. Because it's got to come out, and you know, art is never really finished, you just abandon it, someone said that, at some point. And I think it's really true. You just need to say, okay, now there's life, and you can put it in life, and it can move from art into life, which is what happens when you release it. We didn't know what we would have. There was this guy who had taped us at the Canal Street Tavern, which was a nice little acoustic room, but there was a lot of beer, and you can really hear the beer. (laughs) "Whooooo!" You know, but the song was perfect for that, it was a song called "Ride this Ride." And you can hear this motorcycle coming by, you know - (she imitates a motorcycle revving its engine) - when the door opened and this big Harley went by. So it's very in the moment of that, it's like a little three-minute movie. And then there's the intimacy of The Blue Bird, and there's the nice quality of that, where everyone gets shushed because you can't talk during the performance. And then there's the wildness of when we played at the Curville Festival down in Texas. And when I first heard that stuff I was playing some jazz chords on the chorus of "The Washington Work Song," which a lot of our fans are very familiar with, so it's like, okay, yeah, well there's a C in that chord somewhere. So, I let it go by, but I didn't know if we'd have a live CD when we did it. I just thought, you know, this is cool, this is very real. And the cover of it actually was from DC Pride. That's where it was taken.
MS: Which we love, and people obviously can't see it right now, but they'll go to your website, which is disappearfear.com, correct?
S: Yes.
MS: They can go after this interview and check it out, and there's a picture of the U.S. Capitol right in the background. Do you have a favorite track off the album?
S: Um, not yet, actually. I like "Fix My Life" a lot, I like "Sexual Telepathy," that's really cool. And I like "Is there anybody here?" - that's another Phil Ochs song - I like the way that came out, we recorded that at a show in San Diego. And it goes into a song of ours called "BYOG", bring your own god.
MS: Nice. And of course your "Me, Too" song appears on the "Being Out Rocks" CD, which you contributed to for HRC. That song just kills me.
S: Thank you.
MS: Was that autobiographical?
S: It's the way it was told to me, it's actually biographical. It's actually about my partner's situation with her father, and then it sort of goes into possibilities at the end of the song. In fact, I've done recently some songwriting clinics where we really break down the whole process of writing that song. There's a point where I was writing that song where I really just stepped away from it, and that's really where the epiphany came from. It's that everybody has a war. Everybody has a little voice in their head saying, "Don't say it! Don't do it! Don't be that way! Don't speak up!" And then there's the one that goes, "But wait a minute, you know, what about me?" In fact the words "me, too" are from what she used to say when she was a kid. Her brother's like three years older than her, growing up, and still. (laughs) And she wanted everything he had, because he had the cool shoes, he got to stay up later, it was like, whatever Kenny wanted, she wanted, too. So that's where the "Me, Too" comes from, and those were the only two words she said, apparently, for like the first three or four years of her life. (laughs) They thought something was wrong with her.
MS: She just wanted in on the action. That's all it was.
S: Yeah, exactly. It's like, there's equality, isn't there? (laughs)
SONG: "No Bomb Is Smart"
S: (spoken) The "No Bomb Is Smart" song is actually the title track from the "No Bomb Is Smart" CD. And we have a new CD out now called "DF05 Live." I always want to call it DF Live at 5, but that's not it.
Well this is one more voice across the great big
This land is your land and this is two more cracks
Across the backs 'cause this was my land
Well it's my time to sing now
I'm singing real loud
'Cause I'm not gonna watch this silently in pain
And I'm not gonna let this Earth to down the drain
Once you bought up all the public transit tracks
So there was no way for us to get back home
Had to buy a car to get to town
Made sure that the bus stations all run down
Well it's my time to sing now
I'm singing real loud
'Cause I'm not gonna watch this silently in pain
And I'm not gonna let this Earth go down the drain
First you said they miscounted the votes
Your brother said "no pretzels George, so you won't choke"
How could a coup like this happen in America
"Easily" that's what the brother said "I already told ya"
It's not about good guy
It's not about bad guy
A brain's a brain don't ask me why
But if I am me and you are we
And we're all living in democracy
Then it's hypocrisy to keep pushing us apart
No bomb is smart no bomb is smart
Now I'm riding on the back of a ten ton truck
Through Yucca Mountain safe and quiet
As a nuclear bomb or Chernobyl fountain
Happy birthday B-52 bomber
CNN how can you glorify this drama
Have you noticed that American's on fire
Fueled by the high octane Bush bang bang empire
It's not about good guy
It's not about bad guy
A brain's a brain don't ask me why
And we're all breathing in democracy
Then it's hypocrisy to keep pushing us apart
No bomb is smart no bomb is smart
No bomb is smart no bomb is smart